Whenever I leave my apartment, I always bring two things: my headphones and my Nintendo Switch. Yeah, my keys are KIND OF important and my wallet “lets me function in a capitalist society” or whatever, but podcasts and video games are what hold my attention as I travel from Point A to Point B.

What a second? you might be thinking. You’re saying that This American Life host Ira Glass and my good friend Pikachu are the same? You, sir, are absolutely wrong.

Fair point. But, I bet I convince you in five reasons or less. Like early 2000s R&B artist Eve, let me blow your mind.

1. Driving In Cars With Boys… I Mean, Podcasts and Video Games

Even more important than commuting, podcasts and video games are both amazing for road trips. There is nothing more satisfying than binging through an entire season of true crime, getting to your destination right when the victims get their justice. And the handheld console has been a staple of long-distance drives since the Gameboy got on the scene.

Unfortunately, the driver doesn’t get to catch ‘em all or pick the listening speed settings in either case since they’re the driver. But they get to decide whether the car pulls over to the Foam Stonehendge roadside attraction. So it all shakes out.

2, Pikachu and Ira Glass Are My Best Friends

Podcasts and video games are both extremely intimate media. It is all about making a real emotional connection with the characters and story, feeling as if you’re there as everything unfolds. Remember that tweet where that person is eating ice cream with the three women eating ice cream? That’s listening to podcasts. You’re listening along to a great conversation between your three friends, but you’ve never really met them before and you’re in your footie pajamas at home.

As for video games, the interactive medium is all about losing yourself in the story. Why do you think Link doesn’t talk at all? You inhabit the perspective of the hero, you’re the main character. You are truly the one who fights the good fight, defeats the bad guys, and brings peace back to the realm. And you fall in love, both platonically and romantically, with the other characters. Try googling “keep Aerith from dying” and you will find a lot of desperate Final Fantasy 7 players who want to learn necromancy immediately.

3. Audio in Your Ears Makes It All Better

I love cleaning my bathroom. Okay, I don’t really love cleaning my bathroom. But I love cleaning my bathroom because it’s just me, my podcatcher, and some Magic Erasers. Podcasts are the perfect medium when your hands are occupied. Here’s a non-exhaustive list of all the things you can do while catching up on My Brother, My Brother and Me: clean the bathroom, wash dishes, enter data into Excel, tie your shoes, tie your brother’s shoes, regrout tiles, rearrange the refrigerator, write thank you cards for your Super Bowl party, practice your free throws, pet your cat, dog, bird, iguana or sugar glider.

Video games are the exact opposite (which also makes them exactly the same. Keep up!) The game challenges your hands when you’re not challenged by the previous non-exhaustive list. And because your hands are occupied, you need something in your ears. So whether that’s listening to the soundtrack, blasting a Spotify playlist, or listening to your podcasts, your ears are engaged and so are you.

4. Making It Is Really, Really Hard

Hey, did you know that making a podcast is really, really hard? First of all, it takes a really long time. Seriously, editing by itself takes like four hours per hour of recorded audio. By yourself! At your computer! Then, there is a delicate balance of different skill sets that need to work together for it to work: writers, sound technicians, editors, and the talent on the mic. And no media company wants to put money into it, instead pivoting to video and laying off a ton of audio professionals.

Hey, did you know making a video game is really, really hard? First of all, it takes a really, really long time. Stardew Valley took over four years for one guy to make. By himself! At his computer! Then, there’s the delicate balance of different skill sets that need to work together for it to work: story editors, coders, artists, and actors for all the voice-over. And video game companies pressure their workers to put an obscene number of hours into their games, like the 100-hour work weeks put into Red Dead Redemption 2.

5. The Fun Factor and The Driveway Moment

Both podcasts and video games strive for a benchmark so nebulous and intangible that it’s hard to know unless you are actually doing the thing. For video games, that’s answering the question, is it fun? “It’s impossible to know how fun a game will be until you’ve played it,” writes Kotaku reporter Jason Scheier writers in his book Blood, Sweat, and Pixels. “You can take educated guesses, sure, but until you’ve got your hands on a controller, there’s no way to tell whether it feels good to move, jump, and bash your robot pal’s brains out with a sledgehammer.”

For podcasts, it’s what Ira Glass calls the Driveway Moment. Because many people listen to podcasts while doing something else, it is so difficult to overcome the boundaries of that activity. What if you’re done washing dishes or driving? Does the podcast hold your attention while you’re driving home so intensely that you sit in the driveway until the episode is over? Well, you’d only know if you listen to the whole thing all the way through. And you can hope.

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See, I told you podcasts and video games are exactly the same. I knew I could convince you.