No F*cking Way has the same energy as a high-energy MTV show from the heyday of Jackass and Pimp My Ride. If it existed in video form one can just feel it would involve a lot of whip-pans and fucky camera angles during otherwise uneventful interview footage to keep energy high. Hosts Matt Stillo and James Foster dedicate each episode to taking a person’s larger-than-life, a time that would make one say “no fucking way” in response, and elevate it with “immersive sound design.”

Taking a page out of the storied history of audio drama, No F*cking Way layers sound design over gently-edited recordings of various people telling their bonkers stories. Think less the reserved NPR-styled soundscapes of something like 99% Invisible and more morning radio DJ onomatopoeia approach old MTV series like Blind Date would take. For every subdued background atmosphere there’s something like the cartoon spring boing used to punctuate someone whipping their penis out in episode six (fitting, given the episode’s subject is a frat himbo who gets blasted on shrooms from a stranger on a beach). Ridiculous, lighthearted, and oddly nostalgic, No F*cking Way is a perfect 30 minute addition to your commute.

We were fortunate to talk with Stillo and Foster about the podcast, how they differentiate from other podcasts, and their future plans in podcasting. See below for our full Q&A.

Listen: Apple Podcasts | Spotify

DISCOVER PODS: How’d you get into podcasting?

STILLO: Before I rose in the ranks as a sound designer at a boutique audio post studio in Manhattan (where James and I met), I graduated from NYU’s Tisch School of the Arts and was an actor for over ten years. I performed off-Broadway under the tutelage of Elizabeth Swados and had the chance to work with actors who became podcast greats in their own right (Las Culturistas’ Matt Rogers). But after coming close to a few broadway opportunities and never booking, I grew discouraged and started focusing on audio. A few internships became jobs, which led to working alongside Wes Anderson, Greta Gerwig, and companies like Spotify and HBO. I became a heavy podcast listener in 2015, and by the time the pandemic hit in 2020, two cosmic events happened simultaneously: James and I began work on what would eventually become No F*cking Way, and iHeartRadio asked me to come work in their custom podcast division full-time. Between my formal training in performance and career experience in audio, making NFW feels like the culmination of all the facets in my life. Nothing else has clicked quite like this show, and I’m incredibly proud of it.

FOSTER: After several years of working in a post facility mixing TV and film, I stepped away to start freelancing in hopes of having more say over what I worked on. As I started interacting with people outside the TV world, podcasting kept coming up over and over again. I was fortunate to have connections with people at Freakonomics Radio and iHeartMedia, where my first real podcasting experience started. And once I got a taste for it, I fell in love. 

DISCOVER PODS: In your own words, why should listeners tune in to No F*cking Way?

STILLO: Podcasting is a democratic space, and that’s what makes it beautiful. The bar for entry is low, and the sheer volume of opinions, ideas, and creativity is astounding. However, the bar for production value is also low. So, as professional audio engineers and storytellers, our mission was to fill this void with a show that included the sonic polish audiences are accustomed to in the golden age of streaming TV (although QCODE has seriously elevated the game). I mean, “Hey, let’s get our friends together and tell a bunch of crazy stories” sounds like the most idiotic way to start a podcast. But when combined with immersive storytelling, we knew we could heighten this incredibly simple idea to a cinematic plane. 

No F*cking Way combines the catharsis of re-telling an insane story in the company of friends with the exhilaration of experiencing it in the first place. 

Through intensive editing, scoring, and sound design, we cut to the captivating heart of every interview: imbuing and revealing the joy, terror, and awe wrapped up in each moment. 

While most storytelling podcasts clock in around an hour and change, we believe our audiences deserve better and keep episodes to the most engaging 30 minutes.

Whether thrilling, hilarious, mysterious, bizarre, or chaotic, it is our belief at NFW that we all have these stories. And that any good story well told, edited, and put through our scoring and sound design process can be a great story. Headphones required—no celebrities needed.

Listen to the first 30 seconds of any episode and tell us you don’t want to hear more!

FOSTER: People should listen to NFW because it’s the all-in-one storytelling package. First, the stories are great. Second, it’s layered with sound design and music to create this world where the story is actually happening while you listen. And third, it’s fun. The whole point of the show is to bring people to the ‘table’ and hang out while our friends share the craziest stories of their lives.

Read more: These Fiction Podcasts Want Your Stories

DISCOVER PODS: What kind of feedback have you heard from your listeners?

STILLO: As two people who have basically zero presence on social media—the response has been unbelievable. Last week, the show made Apple Podcasts’ “New & Noteworthy” section in Canada (hello to our Canadian brothers!), which has been the goal (aside from making ‘N&N’ in the US). Our download numbers have picked up significantly, and there’s been an outpouring of incredible comments.

Here are my two favorites: “Get lost in an engrossing world of madcap mayhem that will leave you muttering the show’s title under your breath at least twice an episode.” And “after listening to your podcast, all other podcasts are boring and terrible” — that last one really got me.

One response neither of us expected was legal—a powerful entertainment figure put enough pressure on the show that we had to take down our season finale. Listen to ‘The Lost Episode’ for a recap! Certainly learned a few lessons there.

But what I’ve been surprised by the most are the demographics. I assumed the show would resonate with the male under 40s crowd. But the number of women over 50 that have gone out of their way to reach out has been astounding. But then again, who doesn’t love a good story?

FOSTER: The feedback has been amazing. I’ve heard everything from “I strangely find this show relaxing,” which is hilarious, to “Shit is fire!” Mostly though, people seem to have genuinely connected with the show. They get what we’re doing with NFW, and they love it. But hands down, the best feedback from listeners is when they say, “As soon as the episode finished, I sent it to…” Of course, you invite your friend to a good time! 

DISCOVER PODS: Describe your recording setup? What equipment are you using?

STILLO: James and I have pretty similar setups, but I record an AKG C414 through a Neve 5032 Portico into the UA Apollo x8, compressing slightly with their digital 1176 emulation on a 2018 Mac mini. We record, edit, score, sound design, and mix everything in Pro Tools Ultimate with the help of Izotope’s PP Suite and a few favorite plugins, namely: FabFilter, Waves, and Sound Toys. We source most of our music through the Free Music Archive, and each of us have fairly extensive libraries with which we assemble and produce our sound design. We’ve had great results recording remotely with Riverside.fm, ship dynamic USB mics to our guests to ensure quality recordings, and publish to most platforms through Buzzsprout.

FOSTER: The pandemic has been an interesting time in terms of recording other people, but I feel like everyone has gotten over that hurdle. My studio setup includes iMac, ProTools, Izotope PP Suite, Soundminer, a slew of other plugins, Senn 416, RodeNTG3, FocusriteLS56, and of course, a ton of misc items. 

DISCOVER PODS: What’s the biggest challenge you face as an indie podcaster?

STILLO: Time. 

FOSTER: It’s promotion, marketing, and getting ears on target. We’re in a unique position where the ability to create the show is not a hurdle; it’s what we do for a living. But what’s the point if no one listens? 

DISCOVER PODS: Where do you want to take your podcast?

STILLO: Ultimately, I want NFW to be a continuous weekly show, and I fully believe there are millions of completely mind-blowing stories out there. Scaling the show in a way that allows us to find those stories and share them with our listeners is the dream.

FOSTER: The show is as big as the stories we can tell. So I want to take the podcast to new heights by finding and sharing the craziest stories in the world! And those stories come from anyone. Some of the most unassuming people will have had the most insane moments in life; you just need to give them a chance to share. The ultimate goal is to create a community. A community of people who come and hang out with us every week to be entertained and regaled by unbelievable stories. 

DISCOVER PODS: What other podcasts are you listening to now?

STILLO: My favorite podcast, hands down, is Malcolm Gladwell’s Revisionist History. But also in the current rotation is: Dissect, NPR’s Up First, The Home Improvement Association, Carrier, This American Life, Las Culturistas, Pod Save America, The Bowery Boys, Lovett or Leave It, Mike Birbiglia’s Working It Out, 99% Invisible, Oh, Hello: The P’dcast, Music Exists, and Bear Brook. Justin Long’s interview on Armchair Expert was one of the inspirations for our show, and I’m starting to dive into Swindled and Exit Scam this week.

FOSTER: My most recent listen today has been Armchair Expert. 

DISCOVER PODS: Anything else you’d like to add?

STILLO: I genuinely believe there’s nothing better in this world than sitting down with close friends, having a few drinks, and getting into it. If this show brings you a fraction of that joy—all of our hard work will have been worth it.

FOSTER: I think the only thing to add is that podcasting is still at the start of a massive journey in terms of how we communicate, spread ideas, share stories, and it’s really exciting to be part of that. 

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